Question about dialogue censorship in licensed Yaoi Manga

[kaworuboy]

Hi there! I have a question to ask regarding some of the translation choices you tend to see in much of the licensed English-language manga you get over here. The thing is, I am averse to reading manga online, and strongly prefer to have an actual, physical book in my hands, so much of what I read has been licensed and translated and released over here.

 

 

Now, my main issue here that I want to discuss has to do with the Age and School representation of characters, which are clearly inextricable tied together. Part of the problem, I think, has to do with the differences between how School works in Japan, versus how school works in America.

 

As I'm sure most of you know, in Japan "Elementary/Grade School" goes into grade/year 6, as opposed to year 5. After that, "Middle School" in Japan consists of years 7, 8, and 9 - whereas of course in America it consists o grades 6, 7 and 8. Then "High School" in Japan is only 3 years long and consists of grades 10, 11, and 12, as opposed to being four years long and including grade 9.

 

But as we all likely know, "High School" in Japan is *not* mandatory, and there is a very big hierarchy of schools of varying qualities for students to attend for those three years - some have Dorms, some are extremely hard to get into, some are more like community schools and everyone can get into them. And of course if you choose to attend High School you might *then* continue onwards to what we Americans would call "College".

 

 

OKAY! So after laying all that groundwork, I'd like to get to my point. In virtually *ALL* of the (officially licensed and released) yaoi that is in the "school romance" genre, the translators will essentially *always* go out their way to explicitly state that the characters are in "High School" when they are, in fact, still in Middle School. Very often characters are trying to get into a good High School and struggling with exams or anxious about them, but this is always translated as the characters struggling to get into college and being anxious about it.

 

The best example I can think of, off the top of my head, is Little Butterfly by Hinako Takanaga. If you have not read it, it's a sweet/slightly angsty story about two boys who fall in love, and is much more "shounen ai" than "hard yaoi". It's extremely well done and one of my favorite mangas, however.

 

Now, one of the plot points is of course that the two boys are about to graduate and want to go together to the same school. My edition makes it explicit on the first page that they are "seniors in high school" and in volume 3 there is a lot of talk about getting into "College". The problem is that the characters really obviously look 15 (even the seme) and it just feels absurd and takes me out of the story every time the high school/college thing is mentioned, because it's frankly nonsensical and reeks of puritanical American bullshit.

 

 

I just wanted to open up this discussion and see if I am alone in not only disliking this sort of translation, but finding it confusing. Because I honestly cannot trust an American translation when they say that a character is in "High School" or "College". Because sometimes a character who is stated to be in High School is actually in Middle School - or maybe they really are in High School? And then sometimes a character who is stated to be in College is actually in High School, but sometimes really are in College!! It is dreadfully goddamn confusing.

 

Let's stick with Hinako Takanaga for examples, here - in Koisuru Boukun (Tyrant Falls in Love) it is *very* clear that both characters are at University/College, both because of how they are drawn and stated ages.

 

But then take a look at Takanaga's series Bukiyou na Silent (Awkward Silence), which I quite like. The English edition states the characters are in "High School", and they absolutely could be. But to be frank, I do not know! The could just as easily be in Middle School with the translation aging them up, and the characters are ambiguous in terms of looks to go either way!

 

 

So anyway, I have ranted enough. I am honestly curious about several things - first off, whether I'm actually *right* about all this or not. I'd like to know if other people recognize it, or are bothered by it.

 

And frankly I'd like to know the actual age/school level of the characters in certain manga I like a great deal. Like "Hey, Class President" - this is ACTUALLY in Japanese High School, right? Or "Love is Like a Hurricane" - that is actually in Middle School, correct?

 

And Seven Day Series actually takes place in Middle School, right?

 

Bleh, I could go on and on, so I better just stop. I just seriously dislike censorship in all its forms, for the most part, and dialogue censorship actually bothers me more than the half-assed censorship the Japanese do of penises and whatnot.

 

I am also sorry about the length of this post, brevity is.. not my strong suit

[Saga]

As you stated the Japanese 'school system' works this way: 3-6-3 (years) and they follow, first 3 years are elementary school, the longest period is middle school which takes 6 years and then the hellish 3 years of high school. University years in Japan are not so hard, what is hard is to actually pass the exams, thus they stress over the finals (especially when talking about applying for, as you called it, college).

 

Back to the main points you constructed.

 

I am honestly curious about several things - first off, whether I'm actually *right* about all this or not. I'd like to know if other people recognize it, or are bothered by it.

 

You are, I suppose, right. It's not only about the school system you mentioned. Many 'official translations', meaning 'licensed releases', adapt the text to their rationality/liking, completely stripping the original off its initial meaning. Take the honorifics for example. Yes, they are not something English speakers use unless in a very formal situation, honorifics such as, Mr./Ms./Mrs. and so on. But Japanese have a whole lot new meaning when the honorific is removed, and then again - it depends whether you use only family name or first name. It's just such a 'lost in translation' case, really.

 

But that's just a very plain example. I can speak about 'Itadakimasu' and 'Gochisousama' lamely bound to the widely recognized 'Thanks for the meal' translation. I have seen so many fan translations done very well, yet people assigned in companies as translators do a horrible job. The painful truth comes here, fans translate and do everything for free, yet supposed professionals get paid to do sh.t work.

 

I recalled now that one English publisher, I won't state a name, actually can hire anyone who applies for a translator and supposedly pay them. I got curious once and went to see what is that all about. Well, you have a sample text to translate for 72 hours and submit it. No one asks you for a certificate that you actually DO know the language on, say, native/ fluent level. All you have to do is to translate it approximately good and to make sense.

 

Now, I do not own any English release since I rather go after Japanese releases. But, can't they just dedicate a few pages like notes where they explain a bit about stuff to people. Like, why they would use the honorifics, what 'senpai-kohai' means, and many other things that could be found in original texts.

 

Amateur translators leave notes on pages or at the end of the fan release, explaining to people - which also acts as something educational. So, it would be a nice thing if English publishers do that as well, plus it would give them more room to leave the typical 'Japanese' things in the translation, not getting them "adapted" to whatever makes sense for English readers.

 

 

And frankly I'd like to know the actual age/school level of the characters in certain manga I like a great deal. Like "Hey, Class President" - this is ACTUALLY in Japanese High School, right? Or "Love is Like a Hurricane" - that is actually in Middle School, correct?

 

And Seven Day Series actually takes place in Middle School, right?

 

"Hey, Class President"

 

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Below, on 登場人物 section you have characters listed, all of the characters are in 高校 [koukou], which is the high school, except for two characters I see now:

- 川和公志郎 [Kawawa Koushirou] who is first year judo in 大学 [daigaku] university;

- 山城惣 [Yamashiro Sou] who is also first year judo in university.

 

As for "Love is Like a Hurricane" I couldn't find any concrete information on prima-vista, all I saw was mentioned under 'all boys' school' (男子校 [danshikou]).

 

And by ''Seven Days'' you mean the manga by Rihito-sensei, right?

If so,

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It states it's actually third year in high school, which makes it the last grade.

 

Hope I helped, somehow.

[kaworuboy]

No, you totally helped. I appreciate any opinions and help!

 

You are absolutely right that there are other egregious translating errors - the butchering of honorifics or refusing to include them in lieu of some half-assed localization attempt.

 

And don't get me started on the way translators are inclined to interpret Kansai accents in official translations.

 

I suppose I am on the opposite end of the spectrum to you - I've actually always bought the American releases, primarily because I want to *support* the American yaoi industry as a product which I think is good to have around. Plus, as someone who read tons of unlicensed scanlations and watched tons of fansubs prior to ~2006 when the yaoi/shounen ai industry came overseas, I felt something of an obligation to support the publishers who were putting this stuff out monetarily - even if I had qualms about some of the quality control on the products they were putting out.

 

Also, I had no clue that in Japan the schools were divided up 3-6-3 - like I said in the OP, I sincerely thought that it was 6-3-3. Ah well!

 

But I would really appreciate any other opinions or info people could give about translation "errors". I mean, I know that ultimately the reason why this happens is because America is *incredibly* uptight and repressive about so much as dealing with the *concept* of adolescent sexuality. And I am not talking about *shotacon* or anything here, I'm talking about teenagers who are in the 14-17 range and are figuring themselves out -as far as Americans are concerned, depending on the company you keep you could get thrown in jail for considering such things - even though the age of consent in the state I happen to live in is 16 *rolls eyes*.

 

Anyway, I'm rambling - I just wish we didn't have to sacrifice accurate yaoi/shounen-ai translations on the altar of prudish American values. It's a damned absurd, especially when you consider how transparent the attempts are.

[Saga]

Oh, man. I totally switched them. It's indeed 6-3-3.

 

And actually they don't have 'grades' but 'years'. If you noticed in the links I sent you, or the way I translated it, it's: X year in X school. When we speak of university, it's not so hard to adjust to the Japanese system..but it might be a bit confusing when trying to adjust a grade to the Japanese system.

 

Like, say we have a 17-year-old kid. That'd make it 2nd or 3rd year in high school. Most start the school at the age of 6 but there are always exceptions.

 

Here a nicely done chart, I will explain though it's pretty easy.

小学校 [shougakkou] - Elementary school

中学校 [Chuugakkou] - Middle school

高校 [Koukou] - High school

大学 [Daigaku] - University/College

 

In the first column, you have the years responding to the grade-years of the schools.

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I remember when I had to introduce myself according to the Japanese school system, I was 17 back then.

And the way you say your grade is the year of the school "category" you fall into.

Per se, 「高校２年生」 (kouko ni nen sei) which is literally -> Second year of high school or when you want to say you are just a high schooler you say 「高校生」(koukou sei).

 

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Onto the topic again.

Well, it's not only yaoi though. I read other genres as well, and the same thing exists there. I also recall once another reader, someone just like you who noticed the half-assed job in translation, told me that the official translation had a name wrong.

 

Now, that I can't back up with proofs. But it would be pretty much ridiculous. In Japan a name is something very important. When you are given a business card, for example, with no description (furigana/okurigana) how to read the name, you simply ask even if it's your mother language. It's considered very rude to try to 'guess' the reading of a name.

 

However, in manga we always have the furigana/okurigana of names/titles. Like that:

 

That's actually something like an additional help reading of the kanji characters which help you with the correct reading of the word. So to say...to get a name wrong in a manga...is nearly impossible because you do have the simplified reading, it's like..to get it wrong, I don't know what should happen - I mean it.

 

You are either blind or can't read simple alphabet characters in Japanese. But whatsoever, I am not really sure the person who told me that was completely to be trusted on that one, but if there is just one percent of chance to be true - no comment.

 

Yet again, I think that the 'censor' you speak of (in a way) exists in many reads not only in yaoi and translations from Japanese. Frustrating, isn't it.